TOPIC: Ginseng seed quality?

When buying Ginseng seed,what is the exceptable percent of floaters?......Thanks

For me 1-2% at most generally float initially but then sink within 1/2 hour or so, as they should have been float tested before selling with all floaters skimmed off and removed. I might let up to 5% pass but anything over that would have me contacting the seller for replacement.

More and more you will see floaters in seed which is stratified above ground. The growers now use a viability test instead. Often, no water what so ever is being added during the period of stratification. In that case, the seed must be hydrated before floating as it will nearly all float ....even with a viability test of nearly 95%


I strongly suggest you plant all your seed and don't worry about a float test as much as we did in the past.

Enlighten me on how floaters could be good even if still testing viable.
I get up in the morning that I'm going out and toss my seed to plant for the day in a small tub of water ( Grandad taught me this drinking coffee every morning with him before we would hit the woods when I was a kid ). Then 2 1/2-3hours later I'd drain and put in a bag to head out digging & planting as I go.
Seems to me if you were using seeds that's been stratified and lost so much moisture that they float that these seeds could be far closer to the end of there viability since they've lost so much moisture they float they may not retain enough to remain viable until time to sprout. So wouldn't it be recommended to rehydrate the seeds prior to your actual planting??
The last several years here we've had drought till this year. my seed planting I've done has been 70-80% emergence in most all cases I've monitored. From others though that plant using the same methods as I do I've been hearing a lot of 10%-20% emergence. I'm the only one though hydrating my seeds. Could this be why theirs are not doing as well??

Hi GMCPaul,

Lets approach this from a little different angle. Remember the fire triangle? Fuel, heat, and oxygen are required to start and sustain a fire. Fungal diseases in ginseng are similar in that they need the host plant (in this case the seed), the pathogen and moisture. One of the biggest issues in stratifying seed is keeping it disease free. Just like removing oxygen from a fire, if you remove excess moisture you reduce the chance of fungal disease greatly.

The commercial growers I know of always stratify their seed above ground. This helps to prevent rust which has been associated with temperatures getting too cold. After depulping, they treat the seed with a fungicide and mix it with pre-sifted sand, and place the seed/sand mix into plastic totes in a large cooler. The temperatures are cool, but not freezing. As the weather turns cold, the seed doesn't get so cold as to induce rust. In the spring, the totes are taken out into an open air building to warm naturally. It stays there until it is time to plant in August. When it is time to plant, the sand is washed off the seed with water (this is the only water the sand will see in the cycle). Most of the seed at this point will float. However, the moisture retained in the sand during stratification is sufficient to keep the seed completely viable.

After separating seed from sand, the seed is put into large tubs of water and allowed to soak/hydrate over night. The next day, the seed is stirred well and the remaining floaters are skimmed off. The seed is then spread out to dry again. After a few days, they normally bleach the seed. Some growers rinse the bleach off, others don't. They see this as an additional deterrent to disease organisms. Again, the seed is left to surface dry so it will flow through automated seeders.

The seed I have this year is testing viability in the high 90%s, but about 20% of it will float when it gets to me. Cracking a few of those seeds will reveal that most of those floaters are still good seed. Don't forget, the grower floats the seed also right out of the boxes. So any seed that goes beyond that point, sank at some point.

I did an unwitting experiment a couple years ago with a few ounces of seed that I'd forgotten about after planting and left in a plastic tub behind the seat of my pickup. We were having weather in the 80s when I realized that seed was still there. On a lark I went ahead and soaked it thinking I could use it as material for testing seeder designs. To my surprise, nearly all the seed sank and about half of it was grinning within a day's time. I planted it, and it remained viable (even grinning) in that bed all summer. That fall i moved and scooped up the top couple inches of soil from that bed with some of those seeds in it. I spread that soil and seed over a tilled bed around some ferns and mulched it with straw. Some of those seeds germinated last spring -not a high percentage, but enough to show that the seed can withstand much dryer conditions than we had previously thought even though in this case an additional dormancy period was experienced.


So, when you say

\"Seems to me if you were using seeds that's been stratified and lost so much moisture that they float that these seeds could be far closer to the end of there viability since they've lost so much moisture they float they may not retain enough to remain viable until time to sprout\"

, you are simply mistaken. I understand your logic...as I shared it until I learned better. Now, if seed is allowed to dry out too much, viability will indeed be affected. But seed can be dry enough to float and still be completely viable and in fact show very high germination rates.

Thanks for sharing the info, I'll still be dropping my seed in a tub every morning though as I feel I have Stellar emergence planting wild but it helps explain why they are doing it. When they do the viability tests do they also test for moisture content and ever recommend hydrating the seed more?
Granddad taught me a lot of different things that seem to work for me from hydrating before heading out for the day, to wrapping the wild seed found de-pulped in ginseng leaf blade pieces from the plant while planting, to planting the hill sides the deer seem to avoid due to incline or other accessibility problems, laying downed tree tops & branches over the ginseng spots, covering seed planting in leaf litter when digging and stepping on it first as I walk on. I was taught to not pinch the tops off on young and instead to lay leaf litter & branches over them to hide them and to lay the older plants down to do the same thing.
It all comes natural now and I do it all without even thinking its become so rote or ingrained from years of doing it. I've seriously considered offering my services for free or low cost to help a small to medium grower to observe the methods the commercial folks use first hand but never have gotten around to it as I'm sure there's a few things they do that maybe I should be doing that I'm not ( other than fertilizing & tilling raised beds ) but with none close to me that I know of and I'd need to go there a few times in a year to see all processes I've never gotten around to doing it. Always looking to learn more. Thanks again!!
Paul

No problem Paul.

I think some of those practices are not helpful, but they are not harmful either. I do the same thing sometimes...if I'm not collecting tops I'll bury them in the hole....what I was taught to do....without thinking.

I don't think it hurts to hydrate the seed, however, I would be cautious that it might introduce the moisture necessary to cause disease. In dry times...I think it would help. Stepping on planted seed as you move on is also a good practice as it ensures good soil contact.

I've learned some things on my own through trial and error. But, you need to be observant and willing to fail to learn this way. An example here might be how dry seed can actually get and still remain (at some level) viable. I've also learned a lot from other dealers/growers when I got started. When I got connected to some awesome folks who grow ginseng in Ontario, I've learned much more from them. Most of the things I learn is that what I had learned previously isn't always the best. A good example would be to never refrigerate seed before planting in the fall, or not planting the floaters.

The way I look at it is that the commercial growers have the huge sums of money invested in growing ginseng to do it anyway they want. So, why would they not do things in a way which work out the best? Sometimes we have to sort of translate what they are doing, but it isn't too hard to get the connection with what they are doing and what we are doing and learn the lesson. I have a whole chapter in my book devoted to this particular subject, in fact.

Well Brad I jumped over to your site and was going to grab both your books the Fungicide report & guide and discovered I could add to guide to cart but not the fungicide book. Any chance you could fix that so I'm just making 1 purchase. Considered the planter but without a better picture of it close in to see its functions and construction better I opted to pass at a oneseventy each but if you get some other better pics up I might reconsider though most planting is done while digging any more so less need for it than in the past. Ahhh my back. LOL
Paul

Thank you. I can't discuss anything on my site in more than the most minor reference here on Wildgrown at the insistence of our host.

I did send you an email, however.

Just realized the fungicide report was PDF only, bummer I purchased and will print and ordered your hard copy guide to ship to me. Thanks!!
Paul