TOPIC: Random thoughts and research on securing your patch.

I just got email from a blueberry grower.
He had an entire mountain side planted.
Yep. It all got stolen.
Can you imagine all the effort and the planning only to have some dirt bags steal it all from your family and your children.
So a realistic approach is needed.

RE: Ginseng security layers
Thinking like a military guerilla?

The following is me thinking about a problem and how I would handle it.
Let?s face it?if you are lucky enough to get 10 acres of Ginseng to grow to a 10 year harvest?
There will those who will steal it. So getting a little ?military? is OK to protect your family's future.

In about 5 years I?m looking to buy 25 to 50 acres if I can find it to grow ginseng.
Given the economic potential?I?m thinking that I should invest in some peace of mind against theft.

At the heart of the property would have a large solar array to power the batteries.
Everything would be 12 volt.

First?I?m thinking an electric deer fence if 110 is available.
Buried pressure plates to trigger things seems good. So they go off when 150 pounds trigger it.

It seems the best method would be a series of trip wires.
Yes the deer would set them off..but some could be hung at neck level?and also
On a path?put pressure switches.

In addition to many signs and such? there could be electronic eye beams to trigger hidden cameras.
So the sequence? Lights, camera, audio alarm of notification to retreat, electronic paging or call to local authorities. (don?t count on that much.)

Having a cheap trailer with someone living there with a barking dog is always good.

The theory? If someone is on the wood lot?all hell needs to break loose. The deeper they penetrate..the worse things get.
? Surprise the intruders, scare them.
? Possibly play a loud recording that the authorities have been notified.
? Audio of loud dogs barking.
? Trigger some cameras to capture the images?maybe wireless system to transmit the pictures.
? The thieves need to know that the area is ?bugged? and not ?easy pickings?
? The deeper they go..the more intensive the trip wires and setup until they hit the main patch
? Trigger lights to go off.
? I wonder if police green dye could be sprayed to easily identify the scum.

Good use of electronics seems the key here. They are now very cheap.

Possible use of a fake road?put signs up not to drive on it.
If they do..the truck falls into a 5 foot pit and they are stuck.
In the pit are items to ensnare the vehicle from easy retraction.
Then?you get notified?.and you have their truck and plates.






Audio concept that could be used?



I would think a wireless set up?that would email or page me if the wood lot was breached.

Now I?m saying I?d do any of this?but the psyc. Is the same?make the ginseng pirates very uneasy.


Annoying little traps.. minus the spear attachement.


I think having a crappy old camper that is somewhat visible with a light on and a radio playing?
Maybe some audio recordings that go off on a timer?easily done with a pc.

Seeing that a very good wild simulated plantation could have the potential of $1m?it think
It would be good to look into some of this stuff and have a plan.

So if they steal the perimeter?at least they would not get the seed lot at the center.

Lasers?



Finally?me being a computer programmer?I bet I could set up a program
For all of this with a good controller board and sensors.

A while back I came across an article on a guy who grew weed.
He?d set up his grow room once?then control it via the web?he could turn fans, pumps and so on
At will and even see a video of his operation.

As I enter this domain..I?ll keep you informed of what I find and the best methods.

I have no faith in the police.
Let me know your thoughts.
Keep in mind...the objective is how to secure your site when you are not there.
Yeah..I have a shotgun too. It doesn't to me any good when I'm sitting 100 miles to the north in a cubible in an office and I can't be there.

Feel free to provide some realistic ideas.
I think the key is electronics. Dogs can be poisoned easily.

You ever know how when you put that little gate up to keep your children out of the kitchen, an they always want in,, but the moment you take it down they want nothing to do with it? If you dont give them a reason to go in your woods they wont, and if someone knows you have it and want it bad enough they'll try anything. But this is just my thoughts as I couldnt afford such things, but if you can more power to ya , and am interested in hearing how it works.
Dan

You're seriously recommending other people to build fake roads to \"capture\" them? Come on man, grow up.
Or at least try and think like a grown up, people come here for helpful hints and tips, not extravagant ideas that no one can afford or that don't work. Electronics are cheap nowadays, but coming from someone with a strong physical security background, there are no real-time, inexpensive electronic set-ups that will reliably monitor a patch that your average day-to-day Joe Sanger can set up.
Buying a couple of inexpensive hunting cameras is the closest you'll get, but hide them or put them somewhere inaccessible, people around my way have been poaching game since local laws have been established, they know to look for them.

Steve, I'm not trying to be disrespectful nor trying to put you down in any way. I couldn't help but noticing That you thought that a good sang plantation might be potentially worth $1m. It just seems to me that people see that dried ginseng is bringing 4 to 5 hundred dollars a pound and get these unrealistic ideas about getting rich! Yes, a person could make a nice little bit of money if their crop reaches maturity and the market is still there for it, but most people don't understand all of the obstacles. There is poaching, disease, drought, and the fact that ginseng doesn't just grow well everywhere. I dont believe that anyone could come anywhere close to growing $1m dollars worth of sang on 25-50 acres of land over a 10-15 year period of time. This is just my opinion, I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time!

With that big of an area, there would be enough roots to bypass the middlemen and sell direct. It is certainly doable if you can secure the area, the area is a natural ginseng habitat, and you can sell direct.

While most growers are not going to have optimum conditions, a few will. Mine for example, is a natural patch area, with three feet of humus and moist soils, under 120 foot tall tulip poplars. I have about 5 acres of this habitat for planting and I'm on Cloud 9. If that were 25 acres, I'd be wetting myself.

From growing up on a heavily forested farm and living there now, I can tell you that keeping any sort of fence in a hardwood forest is very difficult to do. Branches or whole trees fall on them on a regular basis. So any sort of electrified fence would take weekly maintenance, if not daily. Easily short circuited, too - drop a bare wire across, or just cut the strands with insulated cutters. Electric fences can stop a 4 legged animal, but the 2 leg variety can usually outsmart them pretty easily.

IR game cameras can photo the guilty party, but by then they've ripped you off. Moultrie makes one that has a cell phone adapter, so you can check it remotely.

Best way to protect a sang crop is for people not to know it's there. Helps to live where you farm, and have an unpleasant or unpredictable reputation. Make them uncomfortable or uneasy, and they might stay away. If they're not wandering around your place, they won't see the crop. But any sort of security just makes a thief curious.

My statement to neighbors on thieves is: if I catch them at it, I'll make an example out of them. I don't say what I'll do, let their imagination fill in the blanks. They can imagine a lot better than I can.

You do realize that based on todays market prices ($500/lb.) we are talking about 2000 lbs. of dried ginseng which would be nearly 3 tons wet? Based on what I've abserved over the years it takes about 200-300 15 yearold plants to make a dried pound. It would take even more 10 year old plants to make that pound. Lets just assume it takes exacty 250(This is very coservative in my opinion) You will need 500,000 plants to survive to this age. On 25 acres this amounts to 20,000 plants per acre. Good luck not having disease wipe out most of the patch with ginseng planted this densely. Don't get me wrong guys, I'm not saying that there isn't some money to be made. I'm just suggesting that people need to keep realistic goals. I will acknowledge that selling higher up the ladder will bring higher prices, but unless you speak Chineese or learn to do so You're not going to cut out all of them. Other than dealers in my state I don't know any other middlemen or how to find them. I really doubt that those dealers are going to help me decrease their profit margin.Dawnredwoods wrote:

With that big of an area, there would be enough roots to bypass the middlemen and sell direct. It is certainly doable if you can secure the area, the area is a natural ginseng habitat, and you can sell direct.

While most growers are not going to have optimum conditions, a few will. Mine for example, is a natural patch area, with three feet of humus and moist soils, under 120 foot tall tulip poplars. I have about 5 acres of this habitat for planting and I'm on Cloud 9. If that were 25 acres, I'd be wetting myself.