TOPIC: "Amending rules in Vermont"

It's going to have to be some easy walks for me if I do get out, no hanging to a ledge by one hand and digging with the other! I would like to get up to where I got all those big ones a few years ago, not a chance though. It's an hour uphill and then down a steep goat path to the spot. I'll pass. Never thought I'd say that!

The letter sent by the state of Vermont is to open the public comment period. If one chooses, they can call the state and discuss any uncertaincies before the changes are set in stone. I totally love the 10 year minimum rule change, it's a win win for everyone and the plant. The season opening and closing dates are a bummer for us northern folks since our climate is different than down south. Unfortunately, the date change was a request from the Federal government in hopes to get all states to have the same dates. Better to keep them happy I guess. Whenever a state changes rules and regulations, they always find a way to sneak a fee in there, and we are lucky it's not a fee that has anything to do with the money exchanged from dealers to diggers. I am one of a handful of dealers and I would rather see us dealers get a hefty fee as opposed to the diggers getting a fee, but thats just my personal opinion. I recommend calling the number on the letter and expressing your concern.

Hope the back is feeling better, I feel ya there, I ruptured a disc last fall and had to rearrange my whole life, jobs and all. But change is good as long as I can get some time in the woods.

Ya, I'll call Tim, Vermont. Sounds like you and I are on the exact same page. As I recall you are getting up on some steep faces too. There is never any green berries up there and a lot of times the berries have started dropping in the end of August. It figures those idiots would stick there nose where it doesn't belong!

I haven't talked to you since you were up last fall. How did the rest of your season go? Did you buy/dig what you were hoping for? Sorry with my accident I won't be getting up to any of those old slobs this year, but who knows, maybe I'll get lucky and find a honey hole down low! Take care, let me know if you hear anything new about the changes.

I sent Tim an e-mail...Hope your back is getting better!

Hey Maya, havent had the chance to reply til now. The reason growers may object to the ten year minimum is because of all the risks and uncertaintees that acompany growing ginseng. Poachers, disease, landslides, trees being blown over, logging roads, the list is endless... every year the ginseng is left in the ground the more the grower is exposing themselves to loss....

It's kinda like playing the stock market.... once that $500 investment grows to an $8000 value should a person let it ride? It could continue to grow in value, or it stands the chance of significant losses up to nearly total loss...

5prong and Maya.

If I may step in? On simulated or cultivated, yes there is always a chance of losing what you have growing to some sort of calamity so I guess it would be the growers choice but on the other hand wild ginseng should be decided more by age and root size. Don't you agree?

Most of the time wild ginseng will take at least 7 years or more to make a three prong and probably 15 years to get any root size ( the norm ).

That's my experience over the decades.

rootman

I think this is more to say about digging wild seng, not so much growing. That's why I put this in the hunting wild ginseng section.

I just don't understand why you would harvest a little plant that hasn't produced much if any berries. That's one sure fire way for a dugger to shoot himself in the foot in the long run. Plus I always get payed mre for older root.

Maya and Rootman, I agree with both of you with the 10 year limit on wild ginseng. In Ohio wild ginseng and wild simulated ginseng are classified as the same. (By Ohio's legal definitions) I was just trying to explain why some wild sim growers would not be in favor of such a law.

Hey fellas have a question or two. Let's say a law was passes and you could not dig anything under 10 years old. Would the buyers buy anything under 10 years old? I guess most of us can most often tell when a 3 prong is to young to dig. Ya just know by looking at it. Yes I have sometimes been fooled by the size of a small 3 prong when digging the mother plant and the smaller plant top was in the same hole and the small 3 prong had a nice size root on it. But you can take a presumably 10 year old root and ask 3 different people the age and get 3 different age estimations. Also most roots do not show bud scars for their first 2 years of growth. So if you do have a root with 10 distinct bud scars it is more than likely a 12 year old plant.

I am all for conservation and letting plants mature. It just seems like a rule that may lose it's momentum with time. A lot of it depends on the buyer. If it passes, will the buyer turn down purchasing a large 8 year old root? I doubt it.

One last thing and I have posted this before. I think it is important to look for every small 1 or 2 year old seedling and to dig it and to transplant it a couple feet away from the mother plant you are digging. If not a lot of small seedling can get damaged in the dig. I know the law says you are not supposed to dig a mother plant if it disrupts the growth of the little ones growing underneath her. However, if these little ones are not moved and transplanted nearby they most likely will not survive due to the over crowding. I do not know many fellas that would pass up digging a large 4 prong because a small 1 year old seedling is growing underneath the mother plant. However, I firmly believe it is important to take the extra time to transplant these little ones prior to digging the mother plant.

One more thing not in the law book, Planting the seeds back in the same hole made from the dig is not a good practice. Important nutrients have been depleted from the soil. Planting the seeds a couple feet from the hole will give the seeds a better chance for growing in soil that contains the good stuff.

Just my thoughts.
Latt

The roots have to be certified by the state, so buyers best not buy them! Also it states in the proposal, \"increase the minimum age for certification from 5 to 10 years, verified by counting neck bud scars\", so there should be no argument imo. The scars are there or not. Most all the dealers get them certified by the state, and not normally by the digger, so I see no issue there. Seems as though the dealers may be in trouble if they are in possession of roots with less than 10 scars, but the proposal does not address this, just the general proposals.

Right now they have to be 5yo and there hasn't been an issue. Buyers do not buy them without 5 scars, so if the rules pass they will not buy without 10. Plain and simple, as a digger don't keep anything without 10 scars, as a buyer, don't buy them, so if it's actually 12, fine, I'd cover my butt and make sure it has 10...If guys want to claim ignorant and start splitting hairs and playing \"if, and , or but\" they are just asking for trouble. 10 scars.....simple!